Originally posted to misc.survivalism on 6 January 2004
Some decent info and sound advice on your site, Rex. ( http://www.tincher.to/jobs.htm )
I'd like to add a few comments which might be useful to folks looking for a job. Or maybe not, as I am no expert. I'm just a guy who has job hunted, and who also has done hiring and firing.
Now, maybe in the IT business it is adequate to post one's resume on the Net. Could be, I suppose. While knowing quite a fair amount about computer systems, networks, programing and such I am not an IT guy by any stretch of the imagination. Could almost certainly handle a lower level job in IT, but not at Rex's level, for instance. (I did look at your resume. )
In any event, I'll try to stay on point and on task, some things I'd like to point out.
This is okay, but realize that in most cases the people yah want to see that resume, are not gonna see it. I just took a look. Currently Google lists a bit over 3 billion Web site pages that it has indexed and ready for searching. First, 3 billion Web site pages is not even close to the full number of Web site pages out there. I don't know how many there are, I doubt if anyone knows accurately.
I do know this. I use the Net and do Web searches a lot. For matters related to my work. Not just to find porn sites, game sites, and chat rooms. I don't even do any of those and have no interest in them. (Fine if other enjoy those sorts of things, but it's just not me). I do quite a lot of serious searches, routinely, for very specific bits of information. The net result of this is that since often what I'm looking for results in very few hits, I readily notice things like the fact I'll get a different number of results back from the various different search engines. And of the results returned by each, it's readily noticeable that search engine A has sites indexed and listed, which search engine B does not. And vice versa. Further, engine C returns a number of sites that aren't listed on either A or B.
Another thing I know. The search engines do not have indexed and ready for searching every page of every Web site. Not even close. The reason are many and varied. Just keep it in mind that it's true. At least half the Web sites I have stuck in my favorites folder because I visit those sites routinely, have many pages with info which are not gonna show up in the results block of a Google search, or Alta Vista, or AlltheWeb, etc. The main Web site will show. If your search criteria matches something to be found there or within the meta tags of that site. But routinely and often, if it's a large site and not just someone's personal small site, there are from dozens to hundreds, maybe thousands of pages not indexed for searching by any of the search engines.
Point is, keep in mind Rule #1. Search engines do not list every page of every site, nor do they list every site.
(Similarly, for whatever variety of reason there are, Google does NOT have a copy of every newsgroup mesage posted in it's archives. Most, but not all.)
Next. There are a friggin LOT of indexed and searchable pages out there, even given they are not all known by any particular search engine. i.e. That 3 billion plus listed by Google.
So if one is doing a search and using as a search criteria words and phrases which are fairly common, you often get return results of 10's of thousands of pages. If not hundreds of thousands, or millions.
My point being, yah can have yourself a nice Web site put up. Have your resume on it. Etc. Doesn't mean much of anyone, of the people you WANT to see it, are gonna see it.
Think about it. Why is someone gonna wade thru 35,451,607 Web sites returned on a search, just to get to yours? Or thru 35,000? Or thru 3500? Or even 350? Are you so important somehow, and your resume so good, that somebody is gonna spend that much time just trying to find YOU?
Okay, all that said. I'm not saying don't put up your resume on your Web site. But if you're gonna do that, it's probably a good idea to take extra steps to get people ... the right people ... to notice it and take a look.
A simple improvement is to use metatags. (Note from the www.tincher.to webmaster: Unfortunately, metatags have been abused so much that the Google search engine now ignores them. Be sure that any important key words occur within your page's text, not just within the metatags.)
Better, MUCH better is to try this. Join some discussion groups, and not only discussion groups within Newsgroups, there are many Web based discussion groups in almost any subject you can imagine. And likely in subjects you never have imagined and wished you'd never heard of once you find out what they're about.
Join discussion groups, Usenet or Web based, which are focused on your field of work. Post, contribute to the group and discussion. Show that you actually have a knowledge of the subject. And make useful, helpful contributions to the group.
And at the bottom of your messages, make sure, like Rex, that you've got your home page with resume listed. ( Note from the www.tincher.to webmaster: Bob's suggestion is eerily similar to the "Stealth Marketing In Usenet" concept explained at http://www.tincher.to/market.htm )
I don't know if this ever helped Rex, in his field. Don't know if he even posted and contributed to groups related to his field of work on the Net. I do know it's helped others. Have personal knowledge of this. Know several guys who've gotten work this way. Wasn't in the IT field, tho.
As an example, one fellow I know. He had work, but was looking for better. He regularly participated in discussion and help groups on several Web based discussion boards. Some were discussion groups for professionals in his field. Some were discussion boards for folks who weren't professionals, but were users of the kind of equipment and services which were in his field of work. He routinely responded to requests for information and help, and provided it. And over in the professional groups he lent advice to those less skilled and experienced than himself. And had friendly debates on fine points and technicalities with other professionals.
At the bottom of all his posts was a link to his resume.
Over time he got a number of offers, most not very good. Some okay but not worth changing jobs. And then he got what he hoped for. The offer he didn't want to pass up.
Just a thought. There are other ways to call attention, from the right folks, to your resume, but you do want to call attention to it somehow rather than letting it be lost in the crowd.
First, keep something in mind. There are many. And not all the same. Nor does any list all the jobs currently being advertised over the net in any particular field. I know, I've actually investigated this. As an example, a friend of mine not long ago was job hunting. And I was helping him. He's fairly Internet illiterate. Doesn't Net Surf much, never has, no particular interest in it. He's quite computer literate, just doesn't Net Surf much. Does email. And there are a couple game sites he visits to do some games and relax. That's about the extent of what he does on the Net.
Anyway, he was job hunting, for one better than what he had. Actually, the money where he worked was fine. He had, however, developed a great dislike for the management. Didn't like the way they did things, their attitude, and so forth. New management from what there had been when he first went to work there. New management was cutting every corner they could, scrimping every penny possible. Telling their people to take shortcuts in the work they did, shortcuts which meant sloppy, unprofessional results. And making people work a LOT of overtime, while refusing to hire new help. No, the Corp was not hard up for money. Business was booming. Profits higher than they'd ever been. And new management wanted even better bottom line results. (i,e, My friend's departmental manager wanted a promotion to a higher position. So he was cutting everywhere possible to improve his bottom line.) Anyway, my friend was getting disgusted. He installs and programs alarm systems, door access systems, etc. And he friggin HATES doing sloppy non-professional work because he's being told to take all the shortcuts, rather than doing it right. And he didn't like the forced overtime. Didn't mind occassional overtime as might be required by the particulars of some job. But week in, week out, for over a year straight, of 60 or more hours per week was pissing him off. Like any reasonable person, he wanted time at home with family, time off to go fishing, had some home improvement projects he wanted to do, dearly loved to putter around in his gardens, etc.
Anyway.
I showed him, just to prove it so it was fixed in his head, that you could call up a listing of all jobs related to his field of work, listed for Minnesota, on Monster.Com, on some other large job board whose name I forget, and on the State run job board. And that there was a very LARGE difference in the listing provided by each. Using precisely the same search criteria.
Also showed him that most of those jobs openings didn't even show up on a standard Google or other Internet search engine.
Next, just to make my point. I logged into a number of Web sites run by assorted employers themselves. i.e. Honeywell, Lenel, ADT, and a handful of others who might have jobs he was qualified for. Searched for and found their listing for what jobs they currently had openings for. Then showed him that in many cases those jobs listed by the employers themselves, were not on Monster.com and the like, nor findable by Google search or similar, and so forth.
Then showed him that the State job board itself, didn't even list most State employee job openings. Nor county, nor city, nor school district, etc.
To find those, and look at em, one had to log in on the human resources pages for the State, or a county, a particular city, etc.
My point to him was, and to anyone bothering to read yet another of my stupidly long posts, that if he was truly interested in serious job hunting, better knuckle down and do the work. I told him to make a list of the probables and likies as concerns sites that might be productive for him. i.e. Monster.Com, the State run job board, a whole list of sites operated by possible employers of people like himself, a few County and City government job boards relevant to the areas in which he was interested in working. And then he was to post resumes readable by anyone interested on places such as Monster.com, and the like. But further, he was to sit down and actually go thru the listings of each site, actually read the job postings. Determine if he was interested. If he was, he was to directly send a resume to whomever. Don't wait to find out if that employer is even bothering to browse the publically posted "job wanted" resumes.
Fact is, most don't. Just ask em. I have been in, am currently in, a position to hire. I don't read "job wanted" boards on the Net. Or in the paper. Ain't gonna happen, ever, most likely. About the only way it'll ever happen would be if I was really, really, really hard up to fill a position. I'd just about have to be desparate. I'm not exaggerating. I'll explain a little about why later. Nor do I even know of a legitimate employer of any size or experience who is gonna bother reading "job wanted" pages on the Net or in a paper. The only people I know who ever do this are 1) Scam artists who're gonna offer you a deal too good to be true and 2) Home owners or very small business owners. The last group read such because often what they're looking for is somebody local to paint something, clean a garage, cut down and remove the stump of a tree, shovel snow, fix a furnace, etc. Usually small, short term jobs, and they want somebody local to do it.
Now, I am sure there must be some folks who have regular decent jobs to offer who read those "job wanted" boards. But I'm here to tell you it's a small minority of the folks who have jobs to offer. More often than not if yah hang a resume out for public viewing on Monster.com or the like, the people looking at it are temp hiring agencies, or some guy trying to figure out how he can scam yah. i.e. By offering a deal that just sounds so good yah can't believe it. Don't.
I'm not saying don't use Monster.com and the boards like it. Do. But do a search, pull up a listing, when yah find something that looks interesting, click on the button to "Send Resume". Take the intitiative to SEND it. Knock on that company's door, yell "Yooo Hoooo, I'm here. Can we talk?"
Be prepared. Company may not accept that standard Monster.com form resume yah filled out on line. Have your own typed resume saved on the ol harddrive. Be prepared to copy and paste. have a printed copy handy. Because some employers that allow on line application and resume sending will use their own system, and you may face several screens of "fill in the blanks" that don't quite foolow the format of your resume. So yah might be better of just typing in the answers. It's nice to have ready reference in hard copy if this is the case. Plus sometimes yah got to take a thing like a quiz. i.e. "Have you any experience with Microsoft Excel spreadsheet (Y/N)", then if you answer yes, it may come up with, "How would you rate your knowledge of Excel; pick one: (Beginner/Intermediate/Expert)"
Still other may do something like present you with the requirement that yah download a formal application in PDF format, print it out locally, then mail or fax it back to em.
Are they trying to make you life difficult? Maybe yes, maybe no
Maybe yes, because some of em are wanting to see if yah have at least enough intiative to get off your sorry, lazy ass, and take an extra step. If you're not willing to do that, they're pretty sure you're not the person they're looking for. It's that simple. Trust me, I've used the same technique for the very same reason. Why was I gonna waste my time reading over the crap some perfect friggin stranger, whom I knew nothing about, who meant not a damn thing to me ... YET, or bother talking to said stranger and unknown person. If that person wasn't even willing to fill out MY form. Or, at my request before I was willing to take the time to talk with person, spend some time gathering up some documentation I'd want to see.
Geez, gimme a break. If that person is that lazy or lacking in initiative ... I didn't want to talk to him or her or read whatever they wanted me to read. Go away. I've got better things to do. Like find somebody who actually, really wants a job.
Maybe no, also. In answer to the above question. Could be employer, or employer's rep, simply has a set system for record keeping and data entry which, if it's followed, saves on unnecessary labor on the part of the employer or rep. Or, perhaps who you're responding to is just a person in the Human Resources dept of a big firm. Typically the Human Resources types don't really know the true nitty gritties of the job or it's requirements. They just know what book says as to description, requirements or whatever. Or know what they're reading on the memo from the head of the Widget Making department. Human Resources type may not even know what the heck a Widget is. Or how it's made. Just knows what he or she sees typed somewhere. So makes up a resume form to be filled out that has the appropriate blocks and so on. Needs yah to fill out THAT form. So Human Resouces type is at least sure he or she got what they know, or think, is the pertinent and required info needed by the person who is actually the one who decides to hire, or not, for that particular job.
So actually look at each job listing that comes up as a result of your search. READ it, the full description. If you're interested, actually DO whatever it takes to get your info to that employer, for sure. It's much the same as knocking on the door and asking for a little attention and notice. "HEY, I'm HERE. Can we talk?"
It's okay to be persistant, Okay to take steps to be noticed. Just don't become an annoyance, bothersome, etc. Be polite and professional and considerate. No answer? Job listing goes away, obviously filled. But new listing from same place shows up later? Go ahead and resubmit. This time the answer might be "Yes". Never know until yah try.
While I'm thinking of it. Resumes age. A lot of folks won't bother looking at resumes that're past N weeks old. Update resume regularly and get one in front of people with a new date on it.
Anyway, it's okay to be persistant. If yah sent a resume, and it's been 2 weeks and you've no answer, and you're really interested in working at that place. Doesn't hurt to send a followup inquiry. Like an email, "Pardon me, I was wondering if you received my previous resume and whether or not the job is still open." Words to that affect. Short, brief, polite. Go ahead and suck up a little if yah want, just don't get carried away. i,e. "I had hoped for a response in answer to my application, one way or the other. As I have great interest in your job offer and possible employment at your company. However, if the answer is "No", I'd appreciate knowing. And thank you for your time. But at least I'll then know I need to look elsewhere." Words along that line of thought. Heck, I've gotten those. No problem. I understand. Would feel the same in that person's place. Only tells me positive things. Person really wanted to work here. But if it's not to be, it's not to be, and he or she would like to know so he or she can press on and consider other offers.
Most jobs are NOT listed on the Internet, nor on any job board, nor in any ads in the papers.
Plain and simple.
I've done job hunting. Trust me. I did some thorough checking. First. those who make a living at such things (counseling people hunting for work) informed me that indeed it's true, most jobs are never advertised in the papers, or at some job board, and so forth. And then, being whom I am, the kind of person who always has this little nagging doubt about accepting something as utter truth until I've checked it out, I did some checking of my own. It's true. There are a LOT of jobs openings never advertised. At least not publically.
That period of time when I had to make the sudden unplanned for decision to get out of the Navy because my wife had been involved in a life threatening and forever crippling accident, I went for the gusto, so to speak.
That is to say, I went all out, no holds barred, in search of work.
The Internet, per se, as most people know of it and recognize it nowadays didn't exist then. Yes, there were BBS's and such, I know, I was a member of several.
So I collected several issues of the major papers around where I lived. To start, I read "every" ad in the help wanted sections. This was important. It taught me some things.
First off. I started to learn what people called various sorts of jobs. This varies a lot, from industry to industry. And from city to city and state to state. Very same job may be called any number of things. Chuckle, I learned names for the things I knew how to do and had done which I'd never heard before.
Secondly. Everyone advertising a job opening seems to have a different idea of how that job should be classed. In what section of the "want ads" should the advertisement or announcement of the job opening be placed. For instance, taking only one of my skills. HVAC repair. (that's Heating, Ventilation, and Air Conditioning).
I found ads for job openings for someone with those skills in employment sections of papers under subcategories of "Educational Jobs", "General Jobs", "Mechanics", "Technicians", "Maintenance Jobs", "Service Jobs", "Hotel/Motel", "Industrial Jobs", "Health and Medical Jobs", "Airport", "Insurance", "Engineering Jobs", etc. I forget the rest off the top of my head. But they were scattered friggin everywhere.
The reason is simple. Human resources person for a school district MIGHT put opening for an in-house HVAC mechanic under "mechanic", or "HVAC", or even under "Educational Jobs" since you'd be working for an educational institution. Same with Hotel/Motel. Heck, they were looking for someone who'd be working at a Hotel, so put listing in that category. Just happened that the kind of hotel worker they were looking for needed to know about HVAC equipment.
I'll give you a hint, and won't charge a dime for it. When searching those internet job boards ... do repeated searches using different search criteria. You'll find exactly the same thing happens. The friend I was talking about earlier? I showed this to him. It's true. There were jobs listed for his line of work that could be found under labels, names, titles, and categories he'd never have thought of checking if I hadn't shown him.
Job hunting can be a job, it can be a work. How serious are you about finding a job? If you're serious, leave no stone unturned, or possibility unchecked.
I didn't. Found the ads for jobs which obviously fit what I was looking for. Sent resumes to every one. Then went back thru ads, found listings that were LONG shots. I -might- qualify, maybe, kinda, sorta. At least I understood the words used. I sent them resumes.
I hit every trade school, vocational school, junior college, regular college, etc in a wide area around me and checked job boards there. Wrote down anything vaguely resembling a possibility, by any stretch of my agile imagination, and sent resumes.
That got me a start.
Then I sat down and got busy. Forget advertised job openings. Opened Yellow pages and did a search. Anybody listed in there, any kind of company, which by any means MIGHT use someone with my skills, I typed name of place, address, etc into a database. Then started printing labels. Trust me, I did a lot of folding and stuffing, licking and sticking. Forget mailboxes. Weren't big enough. I would load up big box stuffed with envelopes and resumes and haul it to post office and mail em hundreds at a time. I've long ago forgotten how many the total was, but it was way over a thousand. I'd hit a thousand before I even truly got warmed up and in the groove of things and got my 'system' worked out into a smooth procedure.
Sound stupid?
Maybe it was. But let me say something. At this time, the economy was in one of it's dumps. Job market really sucked by all accounts. I was told repeatedly by career and job counselors that this was about the worst possible time I could decide to retire out of the Navy and look for other work.
But after a while, each day mail lady was having to shove and stuff my replies into my mail box. There were that many.
Hell yes, I got a lot of "No" answers, More than I could keep count of or cared to. Shrug. My feelings weren't hurt. Those people didn't know me. Wasn't as if they were condemning me personally. I either didn't fit what they were looking for, or was asking too much money, job had been filled before they got my resume, or in a great many cases, there had been no open position in the first place.
Always remember. A 'No' means nothing. Except 'No'. For now, this time, for this position. Don't take it personal. They don't know you, you're not their friend, their neighbor, a coworker, a relative, or anything else to em. You are irrelevant. They neither hate you nor love you. It's simple ... no opening, or yah didn't fit the opening. that's all that 'No' means. So move on, look for the openings which you fit.
Thing is, in those piles of replies, and there were literally PILES, there were replies saying, "Come talk to us."
Yah want to know something else? I was getting 3 or 4, at least, of those "Come talk to us" replies from folks who'd not even been advertising openings as I was getting from those who had been advertising.
Hell, I was even getting phone calls from folks who'd not been advertising with out and out immediate offers. Not a lot of those, but they came in.
Okay, so I went to a lot of interviews. I forget how many, but it was a bunch. I'd have never been able to get by without an appointment book. And it got crowded. I'd have to try to get a prospective employer to make an appointment for an interview 10 days down the road. Several didn't like that and I lost the interviews. Shrug. Nothing I could do about it.
When I went to an interview. I did more than sit there like a lump in the waiting room. If I could, got there early. If not, I often stuck around after the interview. Did what I could to see if somebody would show me around. Or, as I was mostly looking for work in the maintenance, plant, facilities, or engineering departments I might wander off to whereever the maintenance mechanics, electricians, their supervisors, etc might hang around. And I'd try to get acquainted with someone. Just shoot the breeze, say 'Hi', etc.
Other fields may be different. But a lot of the blue collar technical trades people, their supervisors, managers, engineers, and so forth dearly love to show off their stuff. heck, wander down to a good sized boiler room with a full time boilerman, smile and say, 'Hey, mind if I look around? I've worked with boilers. Always like to check em out when I'm somewhere new. Geez, nice looking plant, looks like you're taking care of things well. What's the horse power?" Etc. Same works in a big HVAC plant, industrial or commercial refrigeration plant, factory with a lot of machinery, etc. Find the guy who takes care of the stuff, butter him up a bit. Show interest. He'll talk. Men who fix stuff or make stuff do like to show off their stuff.
And while you're at it, once you've established a little rapport, ask. "Hmmm, got any ideas? I'm looking for work."
Chances are if you seem the decent sort, in conversation have shown him you actually know something, and look like a man who'll actually show up on time and work for your money ... if he has any ideas about an opening in his field somewhere, he'll give yah some tips and hints.
And the fact is, guys who are actually working in a trade usually know about job openings, if there are any, anywhere. And almost always, know about em long before the Human Resources office does.
In fact, most of the time, Human Resources won't ever get a request to advertise a job opening, in many trades.
i.e. Take the job I have now. If I have an opening for a new technician. Human Resources is my option of LAST RESORT.
Most of the time, if I've got an opening, I already have a small list of prospects to fill it in my head. I don't spend all my time in my office fooling around on a computer. Nor hanging around sucking down coffee and smoozing with my peers and upper management. Or trying to impress the pretty secretary. While she is pretty, and I don't mind in the least seeing the occassional flash of legs, or view of cute, pert butt under tight clothing. Fact is, while I enjoy the view, I am married. And as importantly ... watching her, or trying to impress her with my words, doesn't do a damned thing to help me do a better job at what I'm hired to do. Neither does smoozing with the upper management talking heads. Not really. I'll either get a promotion or I won't. In the meantime I'd drawing a paycheck, and I expect I should be earning it.
So I spend all the time I possibly can out and about. i.e. Visiting job site, seeing how things are progressing. Answering questions. Trying to resolve any problems. Talking to my techs, the installers I've contracted, other trades we have to coordinate with, the General, customer the building belongs to, etc. Or I'm visiting sites we will be working at soon. Same deal. And all the while I'm looking around, and paying attention. Getting to know folks, chatting a bit here and there.
I notice men (or women) on those jobs, even if they aren't working for me, and see what they're doing. Quality of work, competency, level of knowledge, and so forth.
After a while, you pretty much know who is worth a shit or not. Who stands out in the crowd of the average.
I take notes, even if only mental. But it's not unknown for me to take literal notes. To write down a name and number. Or ask for a card. It pays to know who is who, who is the bullshitter, and who isn't.
i.e. Last opening I had. I had ideas, but as is my normal way, as we work by the team concept around here, before doing much I asked the techs on my team if they had any ideas for a new man.
This is good. Those guys know a lot of other people in their field of work, or closely related ones. And they too, know the BS'ers from the real thing. And they're unlikely to steer me wrong. If new guy sucks, they're gonna have to fix his mistakes. And our team has pride in it's work and performance. I know they WANT a good man or woman on the team. Makes everyone's good easier. And the work more pleasant.
Anyway, I got several names, from this guy and that. As it turns out, guy I hired was recommended to me by one of my techs. But, I'd also had fellow's card in my little notebook even before that. I'd personally seen his work before, was impressed. He'd been working in a related field. Not the same as the one he does now, but it'd required related skills. He had to learn a lot of new stuff. But that's okay. The man knew the basic skills and basic technical/scientific knowledge and principles. It was just a matter of him applying them to new stuff. But the quality of his craftsmanship which I'd seen before was top notch. And I'd not missed his attention to detail, how he double checked himself to ensure no errors. How he spent time on breaks or lunch actually studying tech manuals on something which was new to him. Wanting to know more about how it worked. Rather than simply which wire do yah connect to which terminal. I'd seen him come in consistantly day in and day out plenty early so he was more than ready to work when 0700 rolled around. In fact he'd get bored and start early sometimes. He didn't kill himself working, but worked steadily, thoughtfully, thinking ahead, doing it right the first time. With the result that while he looked like he was working slower than others, he was nearly always done long before the others. Then he'd go help someone else.
Chuckle, I didn't require a whole lot of convincing to hire him.
My point is .... network, network, network. Person to person. Ask, inquire. Get your face out there, and your name.
This works, BTW, for those in higher positions also. I work for a company. Not large. But fairly sizeable. Around 800 employees if yah count all the various divisions. Last time we were looking for a new CEO, that job was never advertised either. The heads already had a short list in mind when previous guy announced he was gonna retire. The heads get around, too. And network. They knew who was who in our wider area. And who, if any, might qualify and be what they were looking for. Opening was never publicized. They had 3 names that met their qualification who lived and worked in the area. Each got a private letter. An invitation to come talk to the heads.
Yeah, I know. Somebody is gonna mention that some companies, corporations, and institutions such as government offices, HAVE to advertise. And have to review all applications, and give everyone a fair shot. Yadda ... Yadda.
This is true. Even works like that, some of the time. Maybe most of the time. But I got a secret for you. I used to work for the government. And worked for 10 years for a major corporation. Whisper: It stills pays to network and get your name spread around and known to the right people. Those 'open' jobs are not always as open to just anyone as they might seem. That's as much as I'll say about that.
Anyway, I went around for interviews, but I didn't just interview with the top folks. I would get to know others. Shoot the breeze, network, establish contacts, and so forth. Did this other places, too. Even if I didn't have an interview some place. Was just driving by but saw some place that looked interesting. i.e. Properous, busy. Whether they had a "Hiring" sign out front or not. I'd stop. Fill out app, drop off copy of resume. If they had an engineering/facilities department, locate it, go there, and talk to those folks. Again, even if that place wasn't hiring, those guys might know about something somewhere. And often did. I got lots of good leads.
If a person is serious about getting a job, then act as if you're really serious about it. Get up, get out there, and start looking. Knock on doors. Do what yah gotta.
Chuckle, years ago I had one of my sisters come live with my wife and I. Typically in my family people marry once, for life. But it's not always like that. She made a poor choice. I figured as much (but didn't say so) when I found out she'd met guy and married him all in less than 6 months. Anyway, turns out guy liked to drink and he liked to hit.
So she came to live with my wife and I. I let her sit around and relax and recover a bit. But then one day laid down the law. It was time to get on with life, forget past mistakes, forget the asshole. Stop feeling sorry for self. Time to move on. Get a job.
A month later, no job. I inquired. She said she'd been looking but couldn't find anything. Honest, she'd been trying.
LOL ... I put her in the car and drove to a business district street. Parked. Made her get out. And starting at one end of one block, we went into each and every single business we came to while making our way down the block. And at each one I made her wait around after asking to see whomever, ask for a job, fill out an app, etc.
She was working that evening. And kept getting calls and letters later from other places she'd applied at.
My point is, only one place had had a sign out front saying they were hiring. And that's not even the job she took. One she took, manager said he'd only just been thinking about hiring. But when she showed up, he decided. He was impressed she'd been going door to door, missing none, asking EVERYONE. She mentioned that when she was trying to explain why she looked a little hot and sweaty. I think she was gonna tell him I was making her do it. But shut up when I kicked her. :-)
Just some opinions and ideas for those looking in these trying times. Hang in there.
Bob